Seeking Opinions

[EllenD]

Looking for other researchers opinions on the possibility of the mother's maiden name being written incorrectly on child's baptism record. I would think this is rare, but may be a possibility. I have searched the Worrstadt books many times and I can not find anything else that "fits."

My ancestor is Maria Catharina Kraemer, born 18 NOV 1783 (Entry # 25):

http://www.archion.de/p/ae455a8667/

Her father is Johann Lorentz Kraemer. Her mother is Anna Elisabetha Guntrum.

In going through the church books, there is no marriage of Lorentz Kraemer and Anna Elisabetha Guntrum. There are no other children born to Lorentz Kraemer and Guntrum. There is no baptism record for Anna Elisabetha Guntrum (there is a 1735 baptism for Johanna Elisabetha Guntrum, but she died circa 1760).

What I find is a 1770 marriage between Johann Lorentz Kraemer and Maria Elisabeth Steudten (?):

http://www.archion.de/p/7685d8e7ad/

There are 9 other children born to this marriage (1770 - 1789) and the mother's name is always written as ANNA Elisabetha Steudten. Here is one example:

http://www.archion.de/p/e9dae43199/

(For 2 of the children, a Guntrum is named as godparent).

This would be my first instance of the mother's maiden name being written incorrectly and I wonder what other people might think.

Thank you for any input.

Kind regards,

Ellen

 

[user722]

Possibly the priest was not concentrated while writing
and wrote her mother's surname instead of her real name.


Johann Caspar Staudt, cooper
marries on Aug. 24, 1743 in Wörrstadt
Maria Eva Guntrum

http://www.archion.de/p/61a5cdc964/

 

[EllenD]

Thanks so much - I had not found that record.

Regards,

Ellen

 

[eggi]

That's probably the birth of Maria Elisabetha Staudt, 05 Sept. 1748:

http://www.archion.de/p/e0102867ea/

Father was Johann Caspar Staudt, mother Maria Eva, a born Lentz. So Maria Eva was first married to Johann Henrich Guntrum and second to Johann Caspar Staudt.

 

[user722]

The 2 marriages:

1st marriage (1728)

http://www.archion.de/p/6ec36a94fb/

Johan Henrich Guntrum und Maria Eva Lentzin
wurden den 23 ten Nov: ⟨1728⟩ ordentlich zusammen gegeben.
Des Bräutigams Vatter ist Lorentz Guntrum
der Braut Vatter Johannes Lentz.


2nd marriage (1743)

http://www.archion.de/p/6ec36a94fb/

Johann Caspar Staudt, Henrich Staudten Jäger zu Alten=
berg ehl⟨icher⟩ Sohn, des Kiefer Handwerks, und Maria
Eva, weyl⟨and⟩ Joh. Henr. Guntrums gewesenen Kiefers
alhier hinterlaßene Wittwe wurden ordentlich
copulirt am Bartholmeitag. war der 24 te Aug⟨ust⟩


translations:

Johan Henrich Guntrum and Maria Eva Lentzin
were married Nov. 23, ⟨1728⟩
Groom’s father is Lorentz Guntrum
the bride’s father is Johannes Lentz.

Johann Caspar Staudt, ⟨son of ⟩ Henrich Staudt, hunter in Alten=
berg legitimate son, cooper, and Maria
Eva, ⟨widow⟩ of the late Joh. Henr. Guntrum, former cooper
here surviving widow were
copulated on Bartholomew's day, that was August 24 ⟨1743⟩.

 

[EllenD]

Many thanks for the links. I am unsure of the location of Altenberg but will keep looking.

Kind regards,

Ellen

 

[KoenigAguar]

I don't know if this is reaching for a straw, but there seems to be a mountain (or rather a hill, given the topography of that area) named "Altenberg" just at the north end of Sulzheim, the village neighbouring Wörrstadt to the west. Actually, its name is "Greifenberg", but known to the locals as "the finding location of Roman graves in the Altenberg", as per an entry I found on the web, announcing a small local event 3 years ago. Unfortunately, this was the only entry I found mentioning an Altenberg in that area.

Well, this may be close to Wörrstadt alright, but from the wording of the marriage entry, I should expect an actual village or town by that name. Maybe it is just a straw

Good luck for your search

 

[EllenD]

Thank you very much - I will see if I can learn anything! I can not find out information like you have provided through Google maps - thanks for your time! Maybe something will break through. I am always leery when there are great distances involved...

Regards,

Ellen

 

[Jokurz]

Hallo Ellen,

der Vater des Bräutigams Caspar Staudt war Henrich Staudt, von Beruf Jäger aus Altenberg.
Aufgrund seines Berufes wohnte er wahrscheinlich außerhalb vom Dorf. 

Barockkirche Wissenswertes über die Ortsgemeinde
An einer Uferböschung des Mainzer Beckens in südwestlicher Richtung liegt umgeben von Schildberg, Altenberg und Greifenberg das heute 1100 Einwohner (Jahr 2011) zählende Weindorf Sulzheim.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...enzimmer.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0XOa9Bq60P3D7tDO6eyFpF
Sulzheim ist ein Nachbarort zu Wörrstadt.

Gruß
Joachim

 

[EllenD]

This makes more sense to me as the logical location of Altenberg - thank you both for taking time to help me. I would never have found this information on my own! I may not be able to find any more records, but atleast I have a better understanding of the geography.

Kind regards,

Ellen